BDSM in mainstream TV programs

[Tang]

Having been in the UK quite a bit in recent months, I have been interested to see how BDSM has featured in some mainstream TV programs over here, mainly crime dramas, though even comedies have occasional reference to light bondage.

Two examples from the past few months are the series 'Trial and Retribution', this one being the seventh story in an irregular series featuring the same detectives since 1997. The story revolved around trying to work out who murdered a cleaner in a stately home. A fictional BDSM club in London was featured, and while one of their staff was involved in the murder, the owner and the others working there were shown in quite a positive light. In fact the leading female detective, undercover as a Domme in the club, discovered what she had been missing in her sexual life and there were flashbacks to demonstrate this, and she really got into wearing latex and lashing the owner. Whether this theme will be continued in the next story it will be interesting to see.

More recently, the long-running (since 1983) Scottish detective series 'Taggart', featured the so-called Hedgehog BDSM club in Glasgow. The victim was a member who had died of an asthma attack during bondage, and another member, a leading prosecutor, had been kicked out for not using safe words and had been torturing homeless boys. He was brought to justice by the gruff detective with the help of the female owner of a fetish shop, who had a scene spelling out what BDSM meant. It was shown as a hobby of middle class respectable people, including two librarians, and a clear distinction was made between BDSM activity and torture, an emphasis made on consensuality and safeguards.

I wondered if others had come across examples of BDSM appearing in mainstream programs, and receiving either a positive or a negative slant. Given the moves to have higher indecency fines for US TV, I doubt it is a development which will occur in the USA in the near future, but maybe you've seen examples elsewhere. Do you think it is of benefit to the community or does it seem like exploitation of our activities simply to give these programs a bit of 'edge'?

[Aurelius]

Having been in the UK quite a bit in recent months, I have been interested to see how BDSM has featured in some mainstream TV programs over here, mainly crime dramas, though even comedies have occasional reference to light bondage.

Haven't seen the one you mentioned, but the deeply ironic and hilarious 'Ban This Filth' fronted by three old ladies (suburban moral crusader types) featured all kinds of BDSM including ponygirls in their 'campaign'.

The reviews of which filthy new videos to avoid in the shops (complete with excerpts showing why you shouldn't buy them) and the warnings of upcoming filthy TV programs in the next week were particularly useful to this viewer

[Alex Bragi]

Having been in the UK quite a bit in recent months, I have been interested to see how BDSM has featured in some mainstream TV programs over here, mainly crime dramas, though even comedies have occasional reference to light bondage.

Well, it's good to know your trips have been productive.

Do you think it is of benefit to the community or does it seem like exploitation of our activities simply to give these programs a bit of 'edge'?

Well, of course it's got to benefit the bdsm community. The more people see, the more desensitised they become, to anything really. It has less shock value with each viewing and therefore becomes more accepted. But I don't think that's the reason the producers of these shows include these activities.

I think these scenes, for lack of a better word, are like those of lesbians kissing. There seemed to be a whole spate of those on TV last year. Good grief, every other second rate actress was doing it! I’m of the opinion that they were slotted in simply to give these shows a little bit of an edge. Something for people to talk about afterwards, even if the show wasn't worth watching in the first place.

[Master13]

Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Angle both have several BDSM references. It wasn't treated as good are bad, just something some poeple do.

Some examples off the top of my head:
Faith made numerous references to her kinky sex, and was appearently a switch.
At one point Spike shows Buffy a pair of handcuffs and asks her "Do you trust me?"
In a very funny scene, Angle goes to a guy for information, who's wall in covered with paddles. The guy, misunderstanding Angle reason for visiting him, starts to explain that he doesn't spank men. He says something like "I'm sure you have a very nice buttocks, but that just isn't my thing."

[miscolata]

There's an episode of CSI where the investigation leads to a bondage club - the victim turns out to be a professional switch who suffocated when a scene went wrong with a client. The club's Mistress has some fun playing mind games with the main character, Grisham. It certainly doesn't seem to give a negative impression - at least not of the pro-Dommes (the killer however isn't exactly presented as a paragon of maleness).

[miscolata]

Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Angle both have several BDSM references. It wasn't treated as good are bad, just something some poeple do.

A lot of the bondage references refer to Spike and Drusilla in particular (and Spike and Buffy's relationship in the last couple of seasons).

There's one episode when Spike declares he's going to go back to Mexico, track Drusilla down, tie her up and torture her until she falls in love with him again.

[Tang]

Yes, I certainly remember the issue about how rough Buffy liked her sex with Spike or not and the confusion of her facing up to the challenges of her tastes and her on/off relationship with Spike. It was an interesting theme, but because they had to skirt round it, it came out as quite confusing. Generally someone was tied up most weeks in Buffy. Nice amount of leather attire too. There has always been a cross over at points between anything with a gothic flavor and BDSM because there is clothing and imagery the same between them.

[csr]

...Do you think it is of benefit to the community or does it seem like exploitation of our activities simply to give these programs a bit of 'edge'?

I'd have to echo Alex on this one... I think it is definitely done to add 'edge' to the show. People's natural voyeuristic natures glue them to the telly when anything even mildly erotic comes on. For years producers seemed to keep raising the bar when it comes to realism in sex scenes. When this got mundane and lost it's ability to titillate, out came the kissing lesbians—a veritable parade of prime-time girl-on-girl. Now that we are used to that, BDSM seems the natural progression. Hmmm... where will they go after that, snuff perhaps?

I think that showing kink is beneficial to the kink community, but only if it is shown in a positive, accurate portrayal. There are enough bits of mis-information floating around and many practises are quite misunderstood by the 'nilla world... we don't need TV to make that worse. As long as the producers/writers do their research, I'm all for it.

[Tang]

In another thread on this forum, about aliens, I have just been reminded of two of the most mainstream examples of BDSM, 'The Return of the Jedi' and 'The Phantom Menace' in that Jabba the Hut is a slave owner, he has a blue-skinned woman as a pet who he later substitutes with Princess Leia. To some extent this is to portray him as a bad guy and that the society is unjust as it has slavery and gladiatorial fights. However, unlike these other examples, these films which appear pretty often on TV, do not do this to give it 'edge' it is just part of the context, probably permitted by the fact that it is a fantasy setting. However, I am probably not alone of men of my generation who first realised that they liked women in collars with leashes from having seen 'The Return of the Jedi' and I always preferred Princess Leia's predecessor as Jabba's lapdog than the princess herself in that role. Maybe I just have something for blue skin?

[GaryWilcox]

Last night, I saw the movie "The Birthday Girl", with Nicole Kidman and Ben Chaplin. Had some very interesting BDSM switching.

[csr]

... it is just part of the context, probably permitted by the fact that it is a fantasy setting. However, I am probably not alone of men of my generation who first realised that they liked women in collars with leashes from having seen 'The Return of the Jedi'...

Quite right. The blue-skinned girl was HOT, and Leia never looked better than when she was in chains. You and I are of the same generation and I couldn't agree more, although being 13 when it came out in '83 I wouldn't have known just why I enjoyed those scenes so much. Funny to look back at that stuff now.

I have heard it said that amongst the people who regularly play fantasy "dress-up" games in the bedroom, Leia's outfit from that scene is one of the most popular of all time. I wonder if they (vanilla types who do this) include the chain on the collar.... hmmmmm...

[Tang]

Quite right. The blue-skinned girl was HOT, and Leia never looked better than when she was in chains. You and I are of the same generation and I couldn't agree more, although being 13 when it came out in '83 I wouldn't have known just why I enjoyed those scenes so much. Funny to look back at that stuff now.

Yes, I remember seeing that with my family at the cinema, cue embarrassed squirming in my seat. I was glad to see the blue-skinned woman back in 'The Phantom Menace', and was old enough to really appreciate her. When I first saw RotJ I had already identified that some films could make me tingle when it seemed surprising. I had already seen 'Dalek Invasion of Earth 2150 AD' (1964) on TV, it has Peter Cushing as a kindly old time traveler in it. Anyway, in that film there is a scene where three men are 'robotized' in black PVC jumpsuits and I never understood why I liked that, but clearly it was a precursor to my shiny and mind control tastes of later life.

I have heard it said that amongst the people who regularly play fantasy "dress-up" games in the bedroom, Leia's outfit from that scene is one of the most popular of all time. I wonder if they (vanilla types who do this) include the chain on the collar.... hmmmmm...

There is an episode of 'Friends' in which this features, with Ross and Rachel role playing, if I remember rightly, but he keeps seeing someone else's face instead of Rachel's, (his mother's?) and it keeps putting him off. I do not remember a collar in that one. (Don't get me on to the potential of an enslaved Jennifer Aniston). Clearing the enslavement of Princess Leia has been such a icon for men of a certain age. I wonder if it has had the same impact on successive generations seeing it on video/DVD. I suppose this takes us back to how featuring BDSM aspects in mainstream programs/films can open up doors to people who might enjoy it but otherwise would have missed out.

[csr]

... I had already seen 'Dalek Invasion of Earth 2150 AD' (1964) on TV, it has Peter Cushing as a kindly old time traveler in it. Anyway, in that film there is a scene where three men are 'robotized' in black PVC jumpsuits and I never understood why I liked that, but clearly it was a precursor to my shiny and mind control tastes of later life....

Never thought Dr. Who would find his way onto this forum... especially with one of his really early heads. ;-)

[miscolata]

Never thought Dr. Who would find his way onto this forum... especially with one of his really early heads. ;-)

Well, there's always my own personal fave Dr Who assistant and after school TV leather babe, Leela : http://www.shillpages.com/dw/jamesl14.jpg

[Tang]

Well, there's always my own personal fave Dr Who assistant and after school TV leather babe, Leela : http://www.shillpages.com/dw/jamesl14.jpg

Yes, Leela, how could we forget her? She is a lovely combination, she is gutsy and can kill, but she has that naivety which needs a strong man to guide her. I am surprised that there is not more Dr. Who erotic fan fiction, it all seems to be Star Trek based.

Can we think of any other episodes from the series which have BDSM overtones? I remember one where a man is being turned into a cyberman, and another where one assistant is changing into a bird and another woman into a slimy creature, so there is quite a bit of transformation, the doctor himself became half man-half cactus in one story. I am sure there must be some collaring and enslavement themes in some stories. Can anyone remember some particular instances?

[Tang]

Well, there's always my own personal fave Dr Who assistant and after school TV leather babe, Leela : http://www.shillpages.com/dw/jamesl14.jpg

Miscolata, I am just curious, if it is not too personal, can I ask: I can see young men lusting after Leela, what was the attraction for you? Did you want to be her, be dominated by her, take control of her, simply dress like her?

[csr]

Daniel Williamson respectfully asked Leela, on 12/17/2002 7:08:36 PM,

What were you're favourite episodes as Leela? and What are you're favourite Doctor Who adventures from the television series?

Leela replies:
I like the one where aliens invaded my crotch and the Doctor had to insert a miniaturized version of himself and go up there and clean things out.


Check out the "Ask Leela A Question" page at:

http://www.allscifi.com/aridor/Iboar...Leela&msg=7146

[Darkgirl]

My favourite is on at the moment...... WIRE IN THE BLOOD!
The first series jump straight into tourcher and every episode has intrieged me ever since. I think this has a lot of BDSM and not just from the murderer's side but the character 'Tony' that Robson Green plays has MASSIVE BDSM potential with his physicology. WICKED!!!!!! :-[

[Ruby]

Daniel Williamson respectfully asked Leela, on 12/17/2002 7:08:36 PM,

What were you're favourite episodes as Leela? and What are you're favourite Doctor Who adventures from the television series?

Leela replies:
I like the one where aliens invaded my crotch and the Doctor had to insert a miniaturized version of himself and go up there and clean things out.

Check out the "Ask Leela A Question" page at:

http://www.allscifi.com/aridor/Iboar...Leela&msg=7146

I knew there was a reason I was in love with Dr. Who. Well, okay for the fans, many of his incarnations. We could start a whole thread on which version of his Time Lord self was naughtier, who had the sexiest girls, etc. What a great quote - thanks for sharing it and the link.